script tags update (Re: [mpeg-OTspec] Digest Number 549)

[Ken Lunde]

Leonardo,

Perhaps the best way to visualize my point is to simply transpose and re-sort the two columns of the table under discussion (see the attachment). Which would be preferred? The following two separate (and contiguous) entries?

  kana    Hiragana
  kana    Katakana

Or, the following consolidated one, which is functionally the same:

  kana    Kana (Hiragana and Katakana)

BTW, "kana" is the only duplicate script tag in the table.

When you bring kanji into the picture, you're conflating scripts with writing systems. For Source Han Sans / Noto Sans CJK, language JAN is globally declared for scripts kana and hani so that Japan (if thinking of region) or Japanese (if thinking of language) are handled properly in features such as 'locl' and even 'vert', and script latn even comes into the picture for characters such as U+2026 (…) that have different treatment for Western and CJK use.

Best...

-- Ken

> On Apr 1, 2016, at 1:27 AM, Leonardo Chiariglione <leonardo at chiariglione.org> wrote:
> 
> That is exactly what I was trying to say: hiragana and katakana are separate alphabets and, unless for some strange reasons they need to be bundled together they should be kept separate. From a functional or typographic point of view it makes sense to handle kanji, hiragana and katakana together
> Leonardo 
>  
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> From: mpeg-OTspec at yahoogroups.com [mailto:mpeg-OTspec at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Lunde lunde at adobe.com [mpeg-OTspec]
> Sent: Friday, 01 April, 2016 02:06
> To: John Hudson <john at tiro.ca>
> Cc: OTspec <mpeg-OTspec at yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: script tags update (Re: [mpeg-OTspec] Digest Number 549)
>  
>   
> John, 
> 
> From Unicode's point of view, it makes sense to have Hiragana and Katakana as separate scripts. From a functional or typographic point of view, they are treated the same, which explains why a single script tag is used in OpenType. 
> 
> So, to answer your question, I think it is the former. 
> 
> I am simply trying to simplify the table without removing information, and my suggestion does precisely this. 
> 
> Best... 
> 
> -- Ken 
> 
> > On Mar 31, 2016, at 4:44 PM, John Hudson <john at tiro.ca> wrote: 
> > 
> > On 31/03/16 14:29, 'Adam Twardoch (List)' list.adam at twardoch.com [mpeg-OTspec] wrote: 
> > 
> >> In Unicode, Hiragana and Katakana are classified as separate scripts, in OpenType, they share one script tag. There is nothing wrong with that by itself — the OpenType script tags are primarily a mechanism to activate a certain "script-specific processing sub-engine" within the OpenType Layout engine, and both kana variants can be processed with the same sub-engine because their behavioral logic is practically the same. 
> > 
> > Out of idle interest: 
> > 
> > Is the implication of this that Katakana and Hiragana runs identified and separated by script itemisation — based on Unicode script property — are passed to a single layout engine that processes glyphs for both using features and lookups mapped in the <kana> OTL script tag? 
> > 
> > Or is the implication that Katakana and Hiragana, if adjacent, are rolled into a single 'kana' run before being passed to the layout engine? 
> > 
> > 
> > JH 
> > 
> > -- 
> > 
> > John Hudson 
> > Tiro Typeworks Ltd www.tiro.com 
> > Salish Sea, BC tiro at tiro.com 
> > 
> > Getting Spiekermann to not like Helvetica is like training 
> > a cat to stay out of water. But I'm impressed that people 
> > know who to ask when they want to ask someone to not like 
> > Helvetica. That's progress. -- David Berlow

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